Clock Purchasing Tips

Advice From A Professional Clockmaker

Every clock has its own voice and personality, its own special way of stirring a memory or emotion.  To plan for and acquire a clock can be a task for the mind, but to live with it should be a joy for the spirit.

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Consider if you will:  for those of us who own a special clock, there is something nostalgic, even romantic about it.  This is especially true if we own a clock that has been in our family for a long time.  A nice quality clock has the ability to outlast it’s owner, being passed on to new generations. Unlike a static piece of furniture that is handed down, a clock is more like a living thing, a faithful link between one generation and another.  It is a pleasant thought to think of our forebears winding and setting the hands of the clock each week.  Knowing that the clock was there throughout all the important events of life, ticking the moments away, realizing that the sound of its’ chime or strike occasionally hurried them on their way.  When considering the purchase of your first clock or perhaps another clock, whether new or old, you may very well be starting another set of memories and emotions, and perhaps a descendant of yours fifty years into the future will be looking at this very clock and remembering you with kind and loving thoughts.

Because of this, many people put a great deal of thought into which clock to buy.  Although I cannot tell you which style or type of clock to take home, for that is a personal decision, I can share with you some wisdom regarding the different choices.

Before I go on let me make it clear what I will not be talking about here.  I will not be referring to the clock on your stove or microwave, or even your digital clock radio.  I will be discussing those clocks which have more of an heirloom quality to them, usually key wound or weight driven clocks.

When we talk about choices, there are many.  The first set of choices would be regarding the function of the clock.  Some clocks tell time only, others strike the half hours and yet still others both chime and strike.  A time only clock is technically called a “timepiece”.  You will recognize these by the single winding hole in the dial.  Other than  ticking they make no other sounds. A striking clock can be recognized by two winding holes in the dial.  These clocks will generally strike a single number at the half hour and count out the full hour on the hour.  A chiming clock both chimes and strikes.  At each quarter-hour the clock plays a portion of a chime melody and then when it is done chiming on the hour it will begin to strike, or count out the hour.  You can tell a chiming clock from a striking clock because there will be three winding holes in the dial.

Next, our choices fall into different case styles.  There is of course the large floor standing clock, typically called a “grandfather” clock.  These are technically 72 inches or taller.  If the clock is under 72 inches they are called “grandmother” clocks.  You will also find really short floor clocks called “granddaughter” clocks that are under 48 inches.  (In the case of modern era clocks, when we are talking about a floor clock we are usually going to be looking at a chiming clock.) Then we have a variety of wall clock styles such as; Schoolhouse, Railroad Regulator, Vienna Regulator, Jeweler’s Regulators, Wag on the Wall, Figure Eight, and others.  Then come mantle clocks of all shapes and styles, such as;  Bracket, Tambour, Crystal Regulator, Kitchen, Flat Tops, Octagon Tops, Ogee, Half Column, Triple Deckers, Figural, Banjo, Steeple, and Eli Terry style, just to name a few.

If that were not enough, there also are other types of specialty clocks, such as the Cuckoo, Anniversary and Ship’s Bell Clocks. Everyone will recognize the Cuckoo of course.  They come in 30 hour and 8 day winds, some with a music box, some without.  In addition to that some are of the cuckoo and quail variety.  These are somewhat similar to a chime clock in that the quail sounds out the quarter hours and then finishes up with the cuckoo sound on the hour.  An Anniversary clock is the type which are typically made mostly of brass with the gearing exposed and are covered by a round glass dome.  Some are made in the “coach” style having a 4 sided brass and glass enclosure.  The “Anniversary” name is derived from the fact that they are to designed to run one year on one winding.  They are also called 400 day clocks (There is also a 1000 day variety).  Unless battery operated, an Anniversary clock will not chime or strike.  Ship’s Bell clocks are of a nautical style, normally a heavy round case made of brass holds the movement, some have a ship’s wheel around the outside.  The Ship’s Bell clock has a unique striking pattern that is designed to coincide with the four hour shifts of a watchman’s duty on a ship.

To further expand our choices, we need to consider that all of these clocks must be driven by some force.  Most will be weight or spring driven, while others are electric or battery operated.  In the most modern era of clock manufacturing you will rarely, if ever, see a chiming or striking clock driven by electricity.  In this digital age, where chiming and striking is concerned, if it is not key wound or weight driven, it is battery operated. However, through the 1930’s, 40’s and 50’s a large number of electric chiming clocks were produced.  Generally speaking these are not as valuable as their key wound counterparts, although, as more and more people are receiving them from their parents who have passed on they are gaining in popularity.  Even less valuable than an electric clock would be those clocks that are battery operated.  If you are wanting to own a clock that is to be passed on, this is not normally the type of clock you want to purchase.

Obviously this is not an exhaustive list of the types of clocks that are out there, but it covers the most popular items.

Now, to add to all these choices, you must decide between buying an antique or a modern clock.            For most people this will be the easiest decision.  Your personality will generally lean you one way or the other.  Some people just don’t care for old things, where others love the history and romance of the older pieces.  In case you are on the edge, let’s look at some of the differences you will encounter.

If you choose to buy an antique, your choices will be more limited.  Modern clocks can be found in abundance at clock specialty stores.  Old clocks look old and of course new clocks look new.  Buy a new clock and you will be creating your own history, buy an antique and you will be adding to what it already has. New clocks always come with guarantees.  Antique clocks rarely come with a guarantee (Unless you are buying from someone like myself who restores the clocks before they are sold).  Antique clocks have antique value the day you buy them.  Modern clocks may never develop a value beyond their replacement value unless it is a special or a limited edition clock.  (This is not to be considered a negative as most people who are buying a clock are not usually looking at the purchase as an investment but rather as something to simply enjoy. Most people should not be purchasing an antique clock as an investment either, unless they are an experienced collector and know exactly what they are looking at.)  Generally speaking the durability of the older movements is far greater than those which are being produced today.  But remember, no matter how durable, everything eventually wears out and these older movements are already old.  Therefore, unless the clock you are considering has already been properly restored, it may need to be done after you buy it.  More on that in a bit.

Now let’s consider the different ways of approaching the purchase of an antique or a modern clock.

First a little background.  As I said earlier, generally speaking the quality of much older clock movements is far greater than most of what is being produced today. Clocks that were sold for only a couple dollars 100-150 years ago were still running, without overhauls, up to a hundred years later.  This is absolutely incredible and has a great deal to do with their appeal today. How many mechanical items can you think of that have ever been made that have this kind of track record?  Even the inexpensive early American movements that were rather crudely constructed compared with the look of modern movements were extremely durable.  These “inexpensive” models were not highly engineered and were not the most accurate of timekeepers but nonetheless, they were very reliable and could be counted on to strike or chime faithfully each half hour or quarter, whatever the case might be.

The vast majority of the clocks you will see in antique stores and at auctions will be this type of early American clock.  During the nineteenth century in the United States a clockmaking boom occurred where a large number of these inexpensive models were produced.  They were designed to be an affordable alternative to higher quality more expensive clocks that were being imported during this same time period.

Almost all of the clocks coming from France, England or Germany were of the highest quality. Not only were they very durable, they were also highly engineered and were more reliable as accurate timekeepers.  Even the tones produced from the gongs and chime rods were often superior.  Of course, the Americans also made many fine clocks and timepieces, but they were generally produced in much smaller numbers.  Consequently, these clocks command a higher price when they are being sold.

Now then, on to the first rule of thumb for purchasing an antique clock.  Let the buyer beware.  Unless you are an experienced collector you will have very little idea of what you are buying, except perhaps that you like the style and the sound of its’ strike or chime.  Also, you will have no idea about the clocks mechanical condition.  My advice is to buy your antique clocks only from a reputable dealer, preferably, a reputable clockmaker who properly restores and guarantees the clocks he sells.  Be wary of some who will almost literally, band aid a clock so that it will run long enough to sell.  If it has been properly restored it will come with a guarantee.

When you buy from a dealer who sells all types of antiques, more than likely the shop owner isn’t even sure of what he has.  You will almost never receive a guarantee on a clock you purchase there.  Beware of the statement,  “It runs.” or  “It probably just needs to be cleaned.”  When they tell you it runs, it may only run for a few hours!  As to “it only needs a cleaning”, you won’t be sure until you get it to a clockmaker.  The clock may even strike fine while you are there in the store, but it is rarely the strike portion of the clock that fails first.  Of all the many clocks that I have had to restore over the years, it is almost always being restored because it won’t run, not because it won’t strike.

Also, you must be aware of Asian made clocks, usually Japanese, posing as American antiques.  These clocks are usually of far inferior quality, both in case and mechanism.  They are often “copies” of American case and movement designs.  A good customer of mine who owns over a hundred antique clocks recently purchased a particular style of clock that he did not yet have in his collection.  The price was right so he could not pass it up.  The dial on the clock which was obviously old, had the words Ansonia Clock Company written on it, Ansonia being an American manufacturer.  When he brought it to me to look at, I was immediately suspicious as the case was slightly shorter than cases of that style that I had seen previously.  He showed me the dial, but I was still suspicious as the brass dial pan was much thinner than I would have expected on a American clock.  Then he showed me the movement and its’ true identity was revealed.  The movement mounts gave it away and I immediately recognized it as a Japanese movement.  Then the whole picture came together.  Naturally my customer was gravely disappointed.  The clock could not be returned!  In retrospect this man said he should have known better yet he was beguiled by an attractive price which blinded him to telltale cautions.  While looking for a bargain is understandable, more often than not, we get what we pay for!

Another customer brought a clock to me that he had purchased off of Ebay.  It was a Vienna style regulator. Once again, it turned out to be a cheap Japanese imitation.  It was old, but it was practically worthless.  You must be sure of what you are purchasing or you may be sorely disappointed.

The next thing to be aware of is the movement’s mechanical condition.  To be safe, if you are not being given a guarantee you should assume that you are going to have to invest some money in it to get it working properly.  Obviously, this will not always be the case, but you will not know for sure until you get it home and run it for a week   Even then, it could fail a few months later. How much will it cost to get it fixed?  Good question.  Unfortunately you won’t know till you see your clockmaker.  An easy rule of thumb is to figure at least $150 per winding arbor (or large hole in dial where the key fits).  This is not a perfect rule, but it is easy to remember.  Let’s look at an example. 

Let’s say that you see an early American striking clock for sale and you really like it.  A striking clock will have two winding arbors.  Let’s say that it costs $150 to purchase.  Add $300 to that, $150 per winding arbor, and then ask yourself,  “If this clock needs a major repair, am I prepared to spend a total of $450 for it?  If not, are you prepared to gamble on the $150 you are about to pay for it.  Remember, $150 per winding arbor is just an easy to remember rule of thumb, it may cost more, it may cost less.  If you are willing to pay an amateur to repair it you might get it done for less but most professionals whom I speak with are going to charge somewhere between $200 to $450 to restore a striking movement.  That is quite a spread.  (In Central-Ohio the cost is going to be closer to $250-350.) If you are serious about buying an antique clock without a guarantee you should ask a local clockmaker you trust what his average overhaul prices are for the three types of clocks; time only, strike and chime.  This way you will have a better understanding of potential repair costs in your area.

I recommend staying away from buying old electric strike or chime clocks.  Many of the motors that drive these electric movements are no longer available.  Buying such a clock entails potential risk of future breakdown with no available motor for replacement.  Unless you are willing to have the clock converted, by installing a different type of movement, such as one that is battery operated, you are better off to avoid them.

Most clocks within a given style generally fall into a similar value range.  Factors  influencing price are condition of case and movement including how close it is to its’ original state.  If the clock has been professionally restored and it is coming with a guarantee, you are obviously going to pay more.  The advantage here is that you don’t have to worry about having it repaired after you take it home.  Most people are not going to want to pay more for a clock, including it’s possible repair cost, than it is actually worth.  Therefore, having an idea of what these values are is helpful.  Some people may not care.  In this case, if you like the clock, and the cost is within what you are wanting to spend, take the risk and buy it, it may not be there next week.

As to the value of specific clocks, this would be impossible to cover in detail here.  However, I offer these few tips.  First of all you must ask yourself,  “What is it worth to me?”  (This, in my opinion is the clocks real value, unless again, you are a collector for investment purposes or you are planning to resell it.)  After you answer that question, you should then subtract the potential cost of repairs that I stated earlier to determine a reasonable amount to pay for the clock.

For clocks made prior to 1920 these are some generally dependable rules, assuming all other things are equal:

            Chime clocks bring a higher price than strike clocks.

            Strike clocks bring a higher price than time only clocks.

            Wall clocks bring a higher price than mantle clocks.

            Eight day clocks bring a higher price than thirty hour clocks. 

            Short lived manufacturers can bring a higher price than more prolific             manufacturers.

            French and English clocks bring a higher price than most German or             American clocks.

            Electric clocks are valued much lower than key wind clocks.

            Clocks with advertising printed on them sell at a premium.

            Older is better.

Remember, I said,  “All other things being equal.”

Value guides are available for those who want a better understanding of specific clock values.  Unfortunately one book will not be sufficient to cover all the clocks you might see.  These value guides can cost anywhere from $25-60 each.  I have twelve of them and less than half the time am I actually able to find the clock I am looking for pictured within.  Consequently owning these books constitutes quite an investment.  Some of the best books are produced by Tran Duy Ly.  The books are often dedicated to a specific manufacturer like Ansonia or Seth Thomas.  These books contain a history of the manufacturer along with a great many pictures including the date manufactured and often what it’s original cost was.  The values are printed in a separate insert which is updated occasionally.  These values, in my opinion, fall well below what I typically see them sell for. 

For those of you who would prefer more choices, with no concerns regarding  condition and no question over guarantees, the modern clock may be more what you are looking for.

The question I am asked most about modern clocks is,  “Which brand is best?”  In my opinion, and generally speaking, I would not make my decision based on brand name.  The best approach is to find a clock case style that appeals to you, has a tone (assuming it chimes or strikes) that you find pleasant, has the features you want and is in the price range you can afford.

The brand name is, nine times out of ten, a reflection of who made the case not the movement.  The clock movements are normally made by a different manufacturer. All of the manufacturers tend to make nice cases.  More often than not, the more you pay, the better the quality of the case and finish.  This does not necessarily apply where the movement is concerned.  Also, a large case may not mean a large movement.  Many people are surprised to see how small the movements are in some of the larger cases.

Before going on I must mention the clock movements being made in Japan, Korea, India, etc.  These movements are most often found in clocks that you will buy through discount stores and catalogues and are typically 31 day key wound wall or mantle clocks.  Although some of these movements have proven them selves at least as durable as some of the modern German movements, they are engineered poorly and very few repairmen will do any major repairs to them once they are worn out.  Because of this, these clocks are frequently thrown away after wearing out or they are converted with a battery-operated movement.  These clocks would not normally be considered as potential heirlooms.

The largest German clock movement manufacturers are; Hermle, Urgos and Keininger.  There has been some consolidation recently.  Hermle has bought out Urgos and continues to make movements with the Urgos name.  Howard Miller (for years just a case maker) has recently purchased Keininger.  Of the three, I cannot say that any of these companies make a movement that is so much better than the others to prefer one over the other.

Although these German movements are recognized as some of the finest clocks being manufactured today, they do not compare to the quality of movements made many years ago.  Although engineered very well, the problem lies mainly with the material used to manufacture the movements.  Because of this, the modern clock movement will normally run for about 15-25 years before it needs a major repair.  The nice thing is that these movements are always repairable and almost always at a fraction of the cost of replacing the entire clock, case and all.  The clock movement’s life depends on factors such as regular maintenance and accumulated dust as well as the particular design and material of the movement.